There are economic reasons, technical reasons and social reasons. We had it all before…

Just because a new trend comes along doesn’t mean it is a good trend. Remember when Java was pitched as the holy grail that was going to end all of our cross platform issues? Wow that really came to pass huh?

“and this neogeography term needs to die, here and now. It implies that the discipline of geography is broken or unresponsive when in fact it shows the unwillingness to learn the discipline of geography”

I’m starting to agree with that assessment. IMHO, it would seem the term neogeography is being used as more a marketing device. A way to seperate one self from the crowd. In reality, it’s not a seperate discipline, rather a sub-discipline within the big, broad heading of geography.

All they are doing(in most cases) is appling new tools to old geographic basics.

Geography does and can cover almost everything on this Earth. Hence it’s root meaning. No need to re-invent the wheel, so to speak.

Neogeography isn’t changing the entire discipline of geography. Rather the geospatial component of geography is being changed through the activities of the “neos”. Why call/name it neogeography? Maybe it should be called/named neo-GIS, neo-matics, neo-something? Not neogeography, geography isn’t changing, the technology to apply geography is changing.

KoS

“A few years ago Photoshop got popular, and all of a sudden 1000000 kids had better jobs then someone who was in the profession for years.”

Maybe that should be appended with, ” and refused to keep up with technology and trends in the field.” You may not like a trend in the industry, but don’t think that means it’s going away or you can hide from it.

A few years ago Photoshop got popular, and all of a sudden 1000000 kids had better jobs then someone who was in the profession for years.
“

EXACTLY! It reminds me of the MCSEs who came out of cert mills who were suddenly “system administrators”

and this neogeography term needs to die, here and now. It implies that the discipline of geography is broken or unresponsive when in fact it shows the unwillingness to learn the discipline of geography.

Touche.

Old Skool: Stop finger pointing and focus on releasing great software. (Some of you are – keep it up)

New Skool: You will still need the old skool for some things – don’t be too quick to burn bridges.

Everyone: Semantic finger pointing like this is a waste of time. Put your energy into doing something remarkable.

A few years ago Photoshop got popular, and all of a sudden 1000000 kids had better jobs then someone who was in the profession for years.

Perhaps the creation of technical standarts would separate these two types of work. In Brazil theres no specific laws about GIS. Dont know about the states…

Standarts, tight group of professionals, that would separate “noob work” from professional work.

Just so you know, smart people hang out on James’ blog. Directions Magazine is full of irrelevant posters.

To dismiss neogeography as a play toy or as not “real” will only lead to your irrelevancy. That is what I’ve learned in the past few weeks. The more you open your eyes to what folks are doing out there with “GIS”, the more you see.

New geography, old geography… the knowledge is the same, the difference (if there is one) is who is asking and what they expect. The rules about placement, colors, projection,… still apply. But it’s important to embrace “non-traditional” use as that expands the scope of everyone’s knowledge and expectation.

I could write down directions on napkins ’til my hand falls off. Tribal societies could collect GPS points until their batteries run out. James could model ships in Google Earth. Some really smart geodisists could mathematically define a better globe. And software designers could write code for any requirement for a spatial problem. It comes down to input-output and what is needed to be represented and who need to be represented. For both camps, we’re clamoring for affection and connections to groups to say to ourselves “we exist.”

If GIS is a separate identifiable service within our service economy then surely that is because it requires specialist skills. It is something which is hard to do for someone who does not have those skills.

I would argue that there is more to GIS than merely being able to operate software, but an understanding of spatial concepts. If neogeography does not require understanding of these specialist concepts how can it be considered GIS?

Sadly, we have gone from doing GIS right, to doing GIS “just enough to get me what I want”

I shudder to think of the bad decisions that will be made with this “just in time GIS” in the coming future. Sorta like the person who wanted their data projected to a certain UTM zone because “it just looked good”.

Scary times….scary times.

For over 10 years, the move has been to democratize GIS and put it in the hands of the non-GIS user (engineers, planners, etc.) and now that it’s gone further down to the masses they balk?

This make no sense to me. GIS is just another service in our service based economy. And when did GIS vs non-GIS become defined by how easy or difficult it might be?

Maybe I’m missing something but I don’t have someone pick up my trash every week because it is too difficult for me to do, and deer don’t turn into elk at 10,000 feet just because it is something someone arbitrarly set.

Eventually neogeography will mean that much of what used to be done by GIS people, will not need specialist skill. This is a good thing, it was boring anyway.

To me GIS is defined as “whatever i’m doing today”, and what I do will evolve. But the true power of GIS is not derived from tools, but as a way of thinking. And although neogeography is not GIS, our expertise can help inform and promote it.